| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| darren.th |
Posted - 24 August 2010 : 16:01:35
can i declare bankruptcy if i owe lots of money to congestion charges and unpaid penalty's |
| 9 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Reviva UK |
Posted - 26 August 2010 : 00:24:35
We are seeing a rise in "Council Tax Problems" where the person has vacated the mortgaged property, posted the keys back to the mortgage company ( usually Northern Rock ) and then gone Br.
Subsequently the mortgage company claim they have not received the keys and try to frighten the person that they are still responsible for the mortgage repayments even though bankrupt.
The worrying part is that the mortgage company often DO NOT go through the reposession process and eventually the council tax folk start chasing for the current years payment.
Naturally in Br if the property is empty the council tax band is Q which is effectively zero rated ( although some councils either dispute this or have never heard of the band Q) and therefore there is no tax to pay.
If however the mortgage company still have not reposessed the property during the Br period ( No mortgage repayments being made !) then after Br the person starts to become liable again for Council Tax.
We have seen a number of these cases now - all with Northern Rock and the oldest is 2 years since the last mortgage repayment was made and still no reposession.
If I were cynical it would be easy to assume that a mortgage company didn;t want to reflect the real extent of losses by keeping housing stock longer.
Paul Johns
Bankruptcy Specialists
Reviva UK
www.revivauk.com
Real People ..... Real Debt Solutions |
| debtinfo |
Posted - 25 August 2010 : 20:22:57
Council Tax is a little bit more complicated than that, here is the OR's Guidance
40.101 Council Tax
Each District Borough Council levies and collects a tax, called a council tax which is payable in respect of dwellings in its area. The occupiers of the dwellings have joint and several liability for council tax.
Council tax is charged on a yearly basis from 1 April each year [Note 3] but the liability to pay council tax is determined on a daily basis [Note 4]. The billing authority is required to make a demand for payment of the council tax separate to the notification of the amount of council tax and the tax becomes due when that demand is made but most council tax payers agree a statutory monthly payment scheme for payment of council tax [Note 5].
Any amount due and unpaid under the instalment agreement prior to the insolvency order is an unsecured debt in the proceedings [Note 6]. If the bankrupt's council tax is up to date under the instalment agreement at the date of the bankruptcy order, no amount is provable in the bankruptcy as it relates to future occupation of the dwelling. Where a liability order has been obtained by the council, prior to the bankruptcy order being made the whole debt as notified within the liability order becomes due and it is therefore a provable debt as defined in paragraph 40.12.
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| Melanie.n |
Posted - 25 August 2010 : 12:45:58
Council Tax is included in bankruptcy provided it is for a previous year(s) you cannot included any debt outstanding for current year as you technically have until end of March 2011 to pay!
Melanie Nicholas
29 years insolvency experience - 23 of which in the Insolvency Service
- Insolvency Manager
Jones Giles
email me at melanienicholas@jonesgiles.co.uk
telephone 01792 899996
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| debtinfo |
Posted - 24 August 2010 : 22:14:03
I have posted the official line below, i to have seen different answers given but purely because of the way the question has been phrased or just out of misunderstanding. This is usually because most normal people use the general term "fine" to mean anything where you action results in you being required to make a payment. When it is said that fines are not included in the bankruptcy it is a very specific legal meaning as set out below.
40.22 Fines
(June 2008)
Any fine (as defined in the Magistrates Court Act 1980) imposed on a bankrupt for an offence is not provable [Note 15]. This includes parking fines (but see also paragraph 4.22A below) and fines imposed as a result of criminal proceedings.
At section 150 of the Magistrates Court Act 1980 a fine is defined as including any pecuniary penalty or pecuniary forfeiture or pecuniary compensation payable under a conviction. In effect, this means that a fine is usually the result of a criminal conviction.
Where a fine is imposed as a result of the bankrupt being stopped by the police and receiving an on-the-spot fine, i.e. for not having Road Tax on a vehicle, this is also not a provable debt as the activity/inactivity leading to the fine was a criminal offence.
Police officers have the power to issue a penalty notice for disorderly conduct on the street or in a police station for offences which constitute criminality such as shoplifting (a criminal offence under s1 of the Theft Act 1968). Once issued the offender can choose to make payment or request a court hearing. Payment is not considered to be an admission of guilt and results in the removal of the liability to conviction. Non-payment of the penalty notice results in the registration of the penalty as a fine at one and a half times the value of the original penalty, this will not be a provable debt in bankruptcy. Further information regarding what type of behaviour may result in the issue of a penalty notice for disorder can be found on the Home Office website at http://police.homeoffice.gov.uk/operational-policing/crime-disorder/index.html
40.22A Penalty Charge Notices (frequently referred to as “fines”)
Fixed penalty notices or penalty charge notices issued on behalf of a local authority, including those in relation to the London congestion charge, are not fines for the purpose of section 150 of the Magistrates Act 1980. They should be treated as provable debts and will be released on discharge from bankruptcy. This is applicable to the majority of parking fines.
Local authorities make parking regulations, such as traffic regulation orders or traffic management orders and enforce parking contraventions in accordance with the law. Local Authorities were first involved in the enforcement of a limited number of parking acts by virtue of The Road Traffic Regulation Act 1984, although parking offences were still dealt with and enforcement action taken through the criminal court system.
The Road Traffic Act 1991 decriminalised further parking offences and they therefore fell to the local authority to enforce through the civil system. Further information regarding the type of parking conduct dealt with by the local authority, as opposed to parking offences dealt with by the police and criminal court system is available from the following link http://www.parking-appeals.gov.uk/RegAndLeg/RegAndLeg.htm.
Not all local authorities have the same abilities under The Road Traffic Act 1991 and each must possess a Special Parking Area Order before they commence enforcement. Further information regarding local authorities and their specific parking enforcement abilities can be accessed via http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/TravelAndTransport/TrafficManagement.
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| Reviva UK |
Posted - 24 August 2010 : 22:06:32
Interested in your reply as I have been in a few OR interviews where they have confirmed that the congestion charge and other parking fines are payable. whereas last week we were told the contrary at a different OR's office.
Council tax ( although pursued through the Magistrates Court ) is included - although convincing the council of that is often fun.
Paul Johns
Bankruptcy Specialists
Reviva UK
www.revivauk.com
Real People ..... Real Debt Solutions |
| debtinfo |
Posted - 24 August 2010 : 17:36:29
Most parking fines are not really fines through the magistates courts they are penalty charge notices and so do go into the bankruptcy. Even the council ones do go into the bankruptcy as well as the london congestion charge. The only parking one that is not included nowdays are olice ones which are still covered through the magistrates |
| Reviva UK |
Posted - 24 August 2010 : 17:33:25
Hi
Unless the parking fines are from private companies ( for parking on private land ) then they cannot be included in bankruptcy.
As a general rule the following cannot be included.
Court fines ( magistrate court fines speeding, parking etc)
CSA payments
Student Loans form the regulated Student Loans Company.
hope that helps
Paul Johns
Bankruptcy Specialists
Reviva UK
www.revivauk.com
Real People ..... Real Debt Solutions |
| Skippy |
Posted - 24 August 2010 : 17:21:23
You need to take advice about this. As Xmas Baby says it depends on the amount you owe, and you will also need to check if the fines can be included in BR as I know that some cannot.
Speak to the CAB or National Debtline, or alternatively contact one of the experts who posts on here. Their details are in the experts section at the side of the page.
View my blog at http://skippy13.blogs.iva.co.uk/
Only when the last tree has died, the last river has been poisoned and the last fish has been caught will we realise that we cannot eat money.
Last IPA payment made on 28th June 2010 - it's over at last! |
| xmas baby |
Posted - 24 August 2010 : 16:20:17
HI Darren,
Depends on how much you are talking about really. I would imagine declaring bankruptcy for a few thousand to be a bit extreme. If this is the amount you owe is there no better way in paying these fines? Bankruptcy is not any easy option out to be honest.
xmas baby |
