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lisa1981
Starting Member
8 Posts |
 Posted - 11 February 2009 : 21:39:36
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my mum died a few weeks ago without leaving a will so it has to go through probate she owned a house, i am currently an undischarged bankrupt and i have red the rules of probate but still abit confused about it all as if the first 125k goes to my dad and whatevers left then gets split amounst siblings. what if my dad doesnt want to sell the house what happends about the official reciever trying to get the funds to pay towards my debt.
and if my debt was only 7k how much would the official reciever take as all it says is the original debt plus interest and expensizes
thanks lisa |
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Skippy
forum expert
United Kingdom
3290 Posts |
Posted - 11 February 2009 : 21:42:15
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Lisa, I can't answer your question as I don't understand probate, but I wanted to say how sorry I am about your mum.
One of the experts will be along shortly and will be able to advise you x
Tomorrow is a mystery, yesterday is history, today is the present, a gift to make the most of.
View my blog at http://skippy13.blogs.bankruptcyhelp.org.uk/
20 IPA payments made, 16 to go - on the home straight! |
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John
New Member
United Kingdom
73 Posts |
Posted - 11 February 2009 : 22:46:21
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Hi Lisa
legally you have an obligation to inform the OR of the situation as your inheritance now vests in the OR.
You need to establish by way of a valuation of the property just how much your share of the property is worth. For a debt of the size you mention it is not uncommon for a trustee to reclaim the £7K in full then add their own fees, which are not capped in law. These could be in excess of £20K but the total claim must, of course, be limited to the value of your interest in the property.
If there are no means to raise the sum of the claim then a forced sale can be applied for and if granted by the court I'm afraid the property would be sold with or without the joint owners agreement.
I'm so sorry I couldn't have been the bearer of better news and even more sorry for your sad loss.
Take care
timendi causa est nescire
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lisa1981
Starting Member
8 Posts |
Posted - 11 February 2009 : 23:16:23
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would it be better to annul my bankruptcy then?
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John
New Member
United Kingdom
73 Posts |
Posted - 11 February 2009 : 23:23:36
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Hi
to annul your bankruptcy you firstly have to satisfy the trustee that you have repaid your creditors in full.
You then have to pay the trustee's fee before annulment can happen. So I'm afraid the trustees, or rather their fee, is the issue once again.
timendi causa est nescire
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lisa1981
Starting Member
8 Posts |
Posted - 11 February 2009 : 23:31:27
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if i have to give up my whole share which would probably be about 10k if its sold. but my sister lives there so i dont want the OR kicking her out of her home over 7k debt so trying to think of ways around it.
so if i have to pay 7k plus OR fees and whatever else they want to bung on how much am i looking at??
ive been trying to find info and the last bit i found which was begining of last year and they said that the OR added £1700 on top of the debt. i just dont want my sister losing her home over my mistakes
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John
New Member
United Kingdom
73 Posts |
Posted - 12 February 2009 : 07:30:12
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Hi Lisa
the important thing is to establish the true value of your share.
If it were to be established that your estimation were correct (£10K) then the trustee can only claim up to that amount and cannot claim any sum which compromises any of the joint owner's share.
The fee of circa £1700 relates to the OR acting as trustee. If a private sector trustee were to be appointed that's when the fee's can, potentially, go through the roof.
Another option for the OR, rather than a forced sale, may be to place a charge over the property
to the value of your share. With this option, when the property is eventually sold the trustee claims the value of your share as it stands now (e.g. £10K) but can add compound interest of approx 8% per annum. Whatever happens there can still be no claim over and above the value of your share at the time of sale assuming that in years to come your share value will increase.
timendi causa est nescire
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lisa1981
Starting Member
8 Posts |
Posted - 12 February 2009 : 07:36:16
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thanks john
right so the OR could claim and keep all my share of the property whever it exceeds my debt then. thats why im thinking can i just annull then i know im only paying a little bit more then my debt
thanks lisa
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John
New Member
United Kingdom
73 Posts |
Posted - 12 February 2009 : 07:47:03
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Hi lisa
if you're sure that the OR is still acting as trustee it may well be your best option providing that you a) establish the value of your share
and b) you can raise that kind of money.
Is that possible for you?
If it is I would approach the OR with the whole package.
1) this is my inheritance
2) this is it's current value
3) this is how I plan to pay.
I'm sure if you have it all worked out in advance, even though your main motivation is, of course, to protect your family, the OR will be delighted as you would be saving them a lot of work.
I would even suggest that if you do establish that £10K is accurate, an offer of around £7K may be accepted because you are reducing the OR's potential costs in recovery.What's more he will note that you have been 100% honest in declaring the inheritance.
I should add, just for your info, and I'm not suggesting anything, that not to declare could have considerable consequences later.
A little negotiation may well be the order of the day here lisa.
timendi causa est nescire
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Edited by - John on 12 February 2009 07:48:08 |
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RHB
Senior Member
1159 Posts |
Posted - 12 February 2009 : 15:00:21
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| How much is the house worth, is it possible that your dAD will get the loat? |
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Suzanne
Average Member
United Kingdom
869 Posts |
Posted - 12 February 2009 : 15:07:10
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Hi
I think you may be worrying over nothing here. Until probate is obtained you have no inheritance as such, and if most of the estate is tied up in jointly owned property wouldn't this just automatically pass to your father anyway. I would find out exactly what assets are involved before taking this any further as it may be a worry over nothing if you are not entitled to any money until your father passes.
Suzanne Stocker
Bankruptcy Manager
Jones Giles Ltd
www.jonesgiles.co.uk
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John
New Member
United Kingdom
73 Posts |
Posted - 12 February 2009 : 20:11:04
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Hi
actually lisa's original post shows that she has done her homework on this prior to posting.
If there is no will the estate lies intestate. Under the rules of intestacy the spouse is entitled to all chattels, these do not include property.
The first £125K of the property then also passes to the spouse. The remainder of the value of the property is split into 2 funds equally.
One of the halves also goes to the spouse, the other to be divided equally amongst the deceased's children. Hence the wording of lisa's original post.
In bankruptcy the intestacy rules apply, in the absence of a will, on death, not when the distribution of funds is made or known.
timendi causa est nescire
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Skippy
forum expert
United Kingdom
3290 Posts |
Posted - 12 February 2009 : 21:22:49
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I've just seen on Moneysavingexpert.com that as of this week this changed for married people and civil partners in England and Wales:
Now the first £250k passes to the spouse with the remainder to any children.
If there are no children £450k passes to the spouse with the remainder to any surviving parents.
If there are no surviving parents it passes to the any siblings, and if there aren't any siblings it all passes to the spouse.
Tomorrow is a mystery, yesterday is history, today is the present, a gift to make the most of.
View my blog at http://skippy13.blogs.bankruptcyhelp.org.uk/
20 IPA payments made, 16 to go - on the home straight! |
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John
New Member
United Kingdom
73 Posts |
Posted - 12 February 2009 : 23:58:38
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Hi Skippy
nice piece of very current research.
I'm wondering now if lisa's situation falls under the old or the new rules. As her mother sadly passed away some weeks ago it could be that the old rules apply in her case.
timendi causa est nescire
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lisa1981
Starting Member
8 Posts |
Posted - 13 February 2009 : 00:50:42
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hello everyone thank you so much for taking the time to reply.
skippy13 ive gone to the site to read up on it heres the link if anyone else wants to read about it. the rule changed 1 feb
http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.html?t=1481589
i went to see a solicitor today and she didnt mention the rules have changed she just went through the other intestacy rules so either she doesnt know about this or it doesnt apply to me.
i also spoke to a bankruptcy adviser and i can be left off the deeds to the house so thats not a problem and if in the future they decided to sell the house and give me a gift then thats allowed.
it was also confirmed by the solicitor that it would be ok.
thanks again everyone.
if the info helps others or helps you advise others then its worked out good that my situation popped up for you to think about
lisa
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Skippy
forum expert
United Kingdom
3290 Posts |
Posted - 15 February 2009 : 15:47:36
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Thanks for the info Lisa, and good luck x
John, I'd like to say I carefully researched the information, but I have to admit the Moneysavingexpert email happened to appear in my in box the same day!
Tomorrow is a mystery, yesterday is history, today is the present, a gift to make the most of.
View my blog at http://skippy13.blogs.bankruptcyhelp.org.uk/
20 IPA payments made, 16 to go - on the home straight! |
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my mum died a few weeks ago without leaving a will
